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… Learning / stealing from IE and Chrome: Saving screen real estate
Opera approves of Firefox UI ideas
Dienstag, 22. Dez ’09
Firefox 4 mockup, published yesterday:
Opera 10.5 pre-alpha screenshot, published today:
The history of Opera’s user interface isn’t exactly a success story. I wonder whether we should be proud of leading them the right way or afraid of heading the same way as Opera.
35 Antworten auf Opera approves of Firefox UI ideas
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Alexei meint 22.12.2009, 13:59:50:
THe tabs placement has been like than for a long time in Opera.
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dao meint 22.12.2009, 14:02:45:
Sure, but the similarities don’t end with the tabs placement.
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David Naylor meint 22.12.2009, 14:21:36:
That is kinda scary how they appeared at almost the same time.
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Wladimir Palant meint 22.12.2009, 14:23:10:
I don’t think they copied it – rather had the same (obvious) idea independently of Mozilla. Browser user interfaces generally seem to converge, the number of good solutions is very limited and everybody is hitting the same ones.
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John meint 22.12.2009, 14:28:13:
It’s almost as if the FF 4 design group had access to internal leaked builds at Opera. Oh wait, there was one 2 days ago!
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Well, no. Stephen actually presented this mockup in early December at the Mozilla all-hands meeting, and obviously these ideas have been floating around on his blog and on wiki.mozilla.org before that.
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m0ck meint 22.12.2009, 15:20:38:
And obviously it’s bad and/or lame when Opera has something similar to Fx. The opposite is not necessary true. No further comment.
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Eice meint 22.12.2009, 15:24:40:
Mozilla stealing ideas for the Firefox 4 mockups from Google Chrome’s UI was distasteful enough. I’d never imagined that anyone would be egotistic and delusional enough to pretend that Mozilla invented those designs, and now crow that Opera is now copying from Mozilla.
Sigh.
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Daniel Nautré meint 22.12.2009, 15:25:31:
I think the Firefox 4.0 mockup looks better. and I really do like this idea.
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m0ck, I didn’t make such a judgement.
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Digdug meint 22.12.2009, 15:45:58:
Its not as if they’re terribly innovative ideas at this point either. Tabs-on-top ideas have been thrown around for what… 5 or 6 years now, and were implemented by Opera, Chrome, and Safari at some point. The app button idea seems pretty inspired by Office 2007, although some of the compact menu extensions have been doing pretty similar stuff for around a decade now too. Attaching it to the edge of the window is… strange (stupid?), but I wouldn’t call it revolutionary or anything.
At this point the one thing I’m really thankful for the UX team for doing is forcing the Mozilla platform to gain abilities (mostly that ability to draw in the titlebar here) that up until now, Mozilla hasn’t been interested in investing in or accepting into the main tree.
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Opera Seems to Like the Firefox 4.0 Look « Sleeping Cats meint 22.12.2009, 16:30:18:
[…] at the design-noir Blog, it seems someone noticed that the new Opera 10.5 pre-alpha appears a little familiar. With Firefox 4.0 a ways away, but still in the minds of people such as the author of Strata40 and […]
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Just a user meint 22.12.2009, 17:01:09:
Be Afraid! Very Afraid! – The new designs are ugly, and non-intuitive. People are reluctant to just ‘click’ on a button to see what is ‘does’, so hiding all the menu stuff under the ‘applications’ button without any description of what its for will lead to confusion and lead to distaste for the UI. Tabs on top is bad, very bad as it requires more mouse movement to get to the tabs from the content area. I’ve tried Chrome, and hated the UI layout, and dumped it after just of a few days.
This is headed in the wrong direction, and IMO will drive folks away.
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Omega X meint 22.12.2009, 17:29:33:
I see that Eice’s malcontent extends outside of MozillaZine.
What some people are overlooking with this however, is that button lends itself from the Ribbon UI style of menu. I don’t see this as blatant copying but a shift in UI design standards. Microsoft is pushing forward with its Ribbon UI in all of its products now, I’d expect everyone else to follow suit in some form or fashion.
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jr meint 22.12.2009, 19:37:22:
Since the first mockups, I see Firefox 4 UI as a fail in progress.
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Peter Lairo meint 22.12.2009, 19:51:09:
Answer: Be afraid of heading the same way as Opera.
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Olly meint 22.12.2009, 21:14:06:
You’re right, Opera’s UI hasn’t always been awesome. The same is true of Mozilla’s :) Jon Hicks is in charge of the crayons now though, so with any luck Opera’s UI will begin to improve.
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Aaron Train meint 22.12.2009, 21:25:29:
The fact of the matter is that this blog post title is misleading because there’s no proof beyond what has been posted.
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justauser meint 22.12.2009, 21:52:46:
Nice, why delete negative comments, only looking for the positive is a nice way of getting a piece of crap out the door. The Mockups might just well be not even published for review/comment, as anything that goes against the grain will buried. Word will get around, that Firefox is not as ‘open’ as you all would like everyone to believe.
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cuz84d meint 23.12.2009, 06:02:21:
well, the UI doesn’t stop there, their location bar looks just like IE, searching bookmarks and history. I think they been thinking Mozilla is doing something they could try to come out with it first and gain marketshare.
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tim meint 23.12.2009, 09:44:10:
let me remind you who was the first to have tabs in the first place.
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brianlj meint 23.12.2009, 11:10:41:
Yes, 10.5 has a pretty ‘O’ button, but did you realise that Opera 10 has the same button — just not so pretty?
All you had to do was go File | [_]ShowMenuBar
So… who copied who?
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mg meint 23.12.2009, 12:32:49:
You can have button for menus in Opera 10.10 (disable “Show Menu Bar” in File menu), it’s just not on by default (and it looks different).
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josh meint 23.12.2009, 12:46:31:
An actual screenshot versus a mock-up. Who copied who again?
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“let me remind you who was the first to have tabs in the first place.” — according to wikipedia, a browser called NetCaptor (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tabbed_document_interface#History)
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Paul meint 24.12.2009, 13:48:08:
I just downloaded the Opera pre-alpha which actually has the new UI implemented. I see nowhere to get a build of Firefox with it’s new UI.
Sorry but actually implementing something I can play around with trumps posting pictures.
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Chrom meint 24.12.2009, 15:02:34:
Why download a special build when you can just use a theme?
Strata40 has been out since 11 September, 2009.
https://addons.mozilla.org/firefox/addon/14284Fx4 has been out since 14 November, 2009,
https://addons.mozilla.org/firefox/addon/49178Hide Caption has been out since 14 October, 2008.
https://addons.mozilla.org/firefox/addon/9256Hide Caption Titlebar Plus has been out since 4 August, 2009
https://addons.mozilla.org/firefox/addon/13505… and that’s just what I found after a five minute search.
@Digdug
“The app button idea seems pretty inspired by Office 2007, although some of the compact menu extensions have been doing pretty similar stuff for around a decade now too.”From the Firefox mockup page (those images are links to the related articles):
“The new proposed approach to this problem is an App Button which is similar to the single menu approach taken by Windows 7 native applications (Paint, WordPad) and by MS Office.” -
hello meint 24.12.2009, 15:02:44:
“Answer: Be afraid of heading the same way as Opera.”
Yeah, the same way as Opera by adding tabs, the search field, popup blocking, and all sorts of UI features after Opera…
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blog meint 26.12.2009, 21:43:37:
“The history of Opera’s user interface isn’t exactly a success story.”
That’s why Firefox is copying it ?
This is not the “new look” of Opera 10.5, the new look will be changed much later. This look is actually the look of Opera 10, released months ago. The only change is the little O on the top left, that replace the button to show/mask the menu bar. So this button was implemented in Opera 10 as well.
Who’s copying who (as usual) and who’s ridiculous, now ? You. -
Dan meint 27.12.2009, 03:18:04:
This was all stolen from Opera’s internal build leaked. Yet you claim to be the innovator? You never innovate, you never win at speed or security.
“or afraid of heading the same way as Opera.”
So you do not want speed, security and features? (Typical response: “We have extensions for features, not memory bloat like Opera” My response: Extensions make the browser sluggish and buggy and half do not even work because they are not compatible. Opera is lighter on disks too, it is not bloated. What is bloated is you obese fox attempting to have the same functionality as Opera.“Stephen actually presented this mockup in early December”
Not “this” one, he presented a rip off of Opera 10’s skin. All he did was a copy then added some aero, which in turn stole from Chrome. The one I see today is a copy of Opera’s elements. But you claim it is your own? Idiot!“so with any luck Opera’s UI will begin to improve.”
And with this pre-alpha it really has. I do agree though. Some of the old design where a little silly with some of the looks. e.g. 9.6 skin“Why download a special build when you can just use a theme?”
Oh the joys of slowing down the browser :)The writer is misinformed and needs to edit the post. Firefox is stealing from Opera. Quit spreading lies that it is vise versa.
“Why download a special build when you can just use a theme?”
Speed. Something Mozilla has never once seen. -
“Stephen actually presented this mockup in early December”
Not “this” oneHow do you know? Have you been there at the Mozilla all-hands? http://www.flickr.com/photos/johnath/4180643978/sizes/o/
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Frenzie meint 27.12.2009, 12:07:15:
The history of Opera’s user interface isn’t exactly a success story. I wonder whether we should be proud of leading them the right way or afraid of heading the same way as Opera.
As long as you’re not under the delusion that a certain other GUI is a success story, sure. What do you use as a measure for success, anyway? Imitation would seem to be the only more or less objective measurement, and there’s been plenty of that going on over the years.
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Max meint 28.12.2009, 06:58:28:
You should be afraid, no doubt.
Firefox, Opera and Chrome are all heading the wrong way in terms of UI.
Your only hope is if the current interface would still be available to switch to. If not, expect a huge number of complaints.
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Max, there were a huge number of complaints with Office Ribbon. Yet Microsoft still uses it. The difference in this case is that this is Firefox, not Chrome or Internet Explorer. You can make the interface look any way you want.
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@Dan
So you do not want speed, security and features?
Speed? It’s the slowest browser available under Linux.
The only really insecure browser out there is Internet Explorer, in other words it’s not really a viable metric.
Only if you look at the suite as a whole and not the browser alone. If not, then you should compare it to other suites like SeaMonkey instead.My response: Extensions make the browser sluggish and buggy and half do not even work because they are not compatible.
I’ve never had any problems with the ones I use, but a half of 15000 is still a lot and then you get access to a ton of functionality that Opera doesn’t have.
Oh the joys of slowing down the browser :)
He were asking for an existing implementation, I gave him a couple after doing a quick search.
And about the so called “slow downs”, you really should test yourself instead of just writing out what the Opera Gestapo tells you to.Speed. Something Mozilla has never once seen.
I take it you’re talking about Firebird here, in other words a browser that’s several years old. They have come a long way since then.
Also, this is for testing a new design, not speed, and that’s not something that should require a completely new build… Oh, wait, sorry I forgot; Opera doesn’t have proper theming capabilities.
